Cherry Audio Forums

Many modules (including Cherry) are not appearing in right-click > Add Module.

Cherry Garcia wrote: ↑Wed May 20, 2020 11:56 pm Sometimes modules get misplaced. (= These modules have been added to Voltage Modular Core. To get them simply reload Voltage Modular or hit refresh on your library.

Ah! That was it then! Yup, there they are now

Thanks!

andro wrote: ↑Thu May 21, 2020 1:11 am Without wanting to sound pedantic, the term is "normalled", not "normalised". Normalization would imply alteration of a signal to a normal value or distribution. Normalled means a default normal set of connections. not needing patch cables, as in many hardware synths. Knowing this, it's easier to understand the designs I think. CA does tends to be a little inconsistent with the terms, and this may confuse people.

I think it's a great featue, and as CA says, plugging in a cable overrides it, so what's not to like?

https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare/ar ... lf-nornal/

The normalled modules are a great and essential feature if there's going to be complete synth modules in VM while still being able to interact well with the rest of the rack/cabinets and being ease(ier) to use as a complete synth within the rack.
So, this makes total sense when having an ARP2600 module, which itself is a very well known normalled synth.
Even to anyone new to this notion, it's something quick and easy to understand, within a synth (module).

Now, this whole "normalized signals to IO Panel" thing, that's what I don't get, find extremely confusing and even misleading in an education point-of-view. Also, making things way harder than needed, when trying to do simple things like MIDI Channel filtering/assignment, which is a basic feature on any (complete) synth (module)... else, why would you want a complete synth module? If CV was the only solution, you'd stick with separate modules, like they did with the MS-20/TB ones.

This software has it all and did it right almost at the first time.
It support CV, MIDI and even PolyCV in a clear and easily understandable and usable way (it could even be done in hardware, which I think I've seen something like it before at Superbooth, maybe) so it has everything to easily deal with traditional modules through CV without sacrificing polyphonic setups through PolyCV and even easily deal with complete synth modules (which DCO-60 & SynthVoice are) through... MIDI + CV/PolyCV to easily integrate their sections with other modules or even with itself.

Just looking at any "complete synth" modules being produced nowadays (KORG, Behringer, etc), one will see both, CV and at least 1 MIDI DIN input (besides USB). Why? Because it's (now) possible, convenient and makes total sense to have both in a complete (usually normalled) synth voice module.

Would something like this be too much to ask?
These are complete synth modules we're talking here, not regular modules. Using an actual MIDI cable would make total sense (and educational!) instead of this "magic" invisible MIDI connection!
(unless Voltage Modular 2 is supporting MIDI-over-Bluetooth within the rack!?!? )


So, I really don't get the totally superfluous "normalized signals to IO Panel" new feature.
I do welcome the normalled modules, obviously... as I do most of all the other new improvements done in 2.0

PS: Having users nitpicking on features is a good sign that most of the other features are great
...btw, speaking of nitpicking, please Cherry Audio, could you please make all MIDI DIN sockets the same size, please!!!? The size used in the IO panel is fine. Seeing huge DIN sockets next to smaller ones is disconcerting to the brain, to say the least (I'm trying to avoid saying "hilariously sad")

Made a separate post about this: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=969

Koshdukai wrote: ↑Wed May 20, 2020 10:55 pm Found an issue while doing MIDI CHANNEL FILTER -> MIDI IN (don't have MIDI TO CV) -> SYNTHVOICE
where changing Active Channels while playing, it'll trigger a permanent GATE ON impossible to reset unless saving, NEW and loading the patch/cabinet.

Edit: apparently, sometimes this may happen even without touching the Channel filter selections. Just got this without touching them as I loaded the cabinet with that setup.

One other extremely annoying issue I was hoping 2.0 would solve is the Active MIDI input tiny list where it only shows 2 ports at a time.
Problem is, when trying to scroll it with a mouse-wheel, it skips some of the ports, so I'm unable to access those easily (the wheel's 1 tick equals more than 2 lines of the list)

Here's an example, where I'm unable to access MIDI Bus C: A bigger (taller) window with more lines showing would be appreciated, more usable and surely overcome this issue as a side-effect.

Edit: Currently, the only workaround I have is to click on one of the lines and then use the keyboard arrow keys

wavemechanic wrote: ↑Thu May 21, 2020 6:28 am Many modules (including Cherry) are not appearing in right-click > Add Module.

Hi,

This is fixed in the next update, which should hopefully come along in a timely fashion.

Greg

Hi i bought ms vintage bundle and it seems VCO-20 Master Tune is not working.

It´s only happening to me ??

thanks

David,

Thanks for the report. This will be fixed in the next version due out today or tomorrow!

davidamo wrote: ↑Thu May 21, 2020 4:36 pm Hi i bought ms vintage bundle and it seems VCO-20 Master Tune is not working.

It´s only happening to me ??

thanks

thanks a lot, congrats for VM I really love it.

andro wrote: ↑Thu May 21, 2020 1:11 am (unless Voltage Modular 2 is supporting MIDI-over-Bluetooth within the rack!?!? )

I apologise if I have completely misunderstood, but it seems to me you have answered your own question here.

CA have stated that the module represents a 'pre-midi' component. Your stance is that it need not be limited by it's origins, as demonstrated by other contemporary recreations. But as you observed, the current implementation - as I understand it - could very well be perceived as 'virtual bluetooth midi'. As such the module provides a simple and natural (modern) way does it not?

Of course, if your needs are "a midi port no more no less" because that's what you prefer, then I respect your preferences, but that doesn't mean the current implementation doesn't make sense.

By the way, I am not actually averse to there being a midi port - I'm not sure anyone would be offended if there were one? - although I don't see a desperate need for it.

CairnsMuso wrote: ↑Sun May 24, 2020 5:48 am

andro wrote: ↑Thu May 21, 2020 1:11 am (unless Voltage Modular 2 is supporting MIDI-over-Bluetooth within the rack!?!? )

I apologise if I have completely misunderstood, but it seems to me you have answered your own question here.

I own a M-Audio MidAir, have used MIDI-over-Bluetooth and use regularly rptMIDI, so I'm no stranger to WIDI, wireless MIDI or MIDI-over-network(s), being fully aware of its strengths and weaknesses.

...that's why I used that phrase in a sarcastic way, because if that's really what Cherry Audio intended to emulate, then there's an incoming wormhole of needless complexity ahead, regarding point-to-point (source->target) configurations.

CairnsMuso wrote: ↑Sun May 24, 2020 5:48 am CA have stated that the module represents a 'pre-midi' component. Your stance is that it need not be limited by it's origins, as demonstrated by other contemporary recreations. But as you observed, the current implementation - as I understand it - could very well be perceived as 'virtual bluetooth midi'. As such the module provides a simple and natural (modern) way does it not?

Not quite. As is, and at first look, it's superficially easier for simple 1 instrument (of stack layer of instruments) setup, where every synth-module in the rack will play the same incoming notes unless cables are involved to break the normalled connections.

But as soon as you want/need to use Voltage Modular as a rack of instruments (and not 1 hug instrument), routing note+performance information from different (MIDI) sources to different synth-in-a-module like these, you go from "dumb-simple" to the "ugly-messy" opposite.

You go from this false sense of clean design:
To this needlessly complex/messy (in these cases of synth-in-a-module instrument) end result:
Where all of that could be achieved with 1 MIDI cable per instrument, in these synth-in-a-module cases which I'm glad they exist in Voltage Modular, but not at the expense of perfectly reasonable and natural middle-ground solution design, like I suggested previously, by doing what any hardware currently (re)made has: a MIDI IN port.

CairnsMuso wrote: ↑Sun May 24, 2020 5:48 am Of course, if your needs are "a midi port no more no less" because that's what you prefer, then I respect your preferences, but that doesn't mean the current implementation doesn't make sense.

That's the issue here (at least to me): It does not make any sense at all! Why? Because Cherry Audio sometimes forgets about their own brilliant and smart(er) solutions. This reminds me how it was handling polyphonic setup prior to coming up with the natural PolyCV solution.

In this case, I'm assuming that Cherry Audio is trying to make it simple(r) for the newcomer to just drag a synth(module) and start playing with it... before realizing that it needs to connect its audio output. Achieving that, it won't even think about the incoming notes+performance data, because it'll magically work, once getting over that audio out hiccup.

But, if that's what Cherry Audio is trying to achieve, why not allow these modules to self-connect to the MIDI port and MAIN OUTs in the first place?
Then this would be truly easy to use to the beginner while also being educational to anyone looking at it "ah, I see, this is working because it's connected to a MIDI source and to an audio out".

Additionally, if Cherry Audio was trying to get rid of messy cables (just in this case) then they also already have the solution: Buses!

If they want this to be less (cable) messy to the beginner, then have a default toggle to "Use Buses" and hide all the auto-connected cables from these modules, through Buses connections.

For those not bothered with (necessary) cables, they can toggle that option off so any auto-connections will happen with cables and not with Buses.

These 2 notions: the already existing Buses feature together with the unfortunately non-existing self-connecting feature would achieve both an easier UX to the beginner while also being educational, because the connections to/from the instruments and the IO ports are still there to check and inspect, instead of being magically invisible, confusing understanding minds trying to learn how these things are supposed to properly work (and might work in an hardware environment).

Self-connecting instruments (with MIDI in) would be the feature to have, not this awkwardly confusing "normalized signals to IO Panel" UX aberration... IMHO.

CairnsMuso wrote: ↑Sun May 24, 2020 5:48 am By the way, I am not actually averse to there being a midi port - I'm not sure anyone would be offended if there were one? - although I don't see a desperate need for it.

I understand, we're just discussing ideas here. I'm trying to make my point, saying that there's actually a somewhat desperate need for a less confusing and more educational solution to this.

I guess it all starts with: What problem was Cherry Audio trying to solve with this feature?

...because if they weren't trying to solve anything and the main reason behind this is "DC0-60 and Synthvoice are emulating analog synths, so they naturally don't have MIDI inputs." then I'll be extremely worried and somewhat scared with what's going on at Cherry Audio.

If an easier UX was the main goal, then please apply "the magic" to auto-magically-connecting modules, not to invisible connections between modules and the IO panel. That's just fairy-tale levels of wrongness and totally noneducational.
If it needs to be (optionally) invisible, then please use your own new feature: Buses


To sum up (IMHO):

• "normalled modules": GOOD!
• Buses: GOOD!
• "normalized signals to IO Panel": BAD!

Koshdukai wrote: ↑Thu May 21, 2020 8:43 am [...]
The normalled modules are a great and essential feature if there's going to be complete synth modules in VM while still being able to interact well with the rest of the rack/cabinets and being ease(ier) to use as a complete synth within the rack.
So, this makes total sense when having an ARP2600 module, which itself is a very well known normalled synth.
Even to anyone new to this notion, it's something quick and easy to understand, within a synth (module).
[...]
Would something like this be too much to ask?


[...]

PS: and please Cherry Audio, please fix the MIDI DIN sizes in some of the modules, please!